Friday, May 08, 2009

An Excellent Episode of The Outer Limits

The newer series, which is good. The original was pretty bad.

I remember seeing this episode back when it originally aired. It seems rather relevant to my life right now.

It is a story of a religious commune led by a charismatic man who is addressed as "Father". They decide to build a new and simpler life for themselves in a wilderness area of the American West. At least, that's what the rank and believe, until three men discover a terrible secret.

It is a story that expresses my own emerging view about how faith can be used to control and dominate others



[Video Link]

10 comments:

wrf3 said...

I'm curious as to why it has become a revelation that faith can be used to control and dominate others. It should be obvious that this is so. So can guns. So can pencils (political rhetoric hasn't changed in millennia). The problem isn't faith (or guns, or pencils) but the people that wield them. That there are predators in the Church shouldn't be a surprise ("I know that after I have gone, savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock. Some even from your own group will come distorting the truth in order to entice the disciples to follow them.") It doesn't lessen the fact that Jesus died and rose again and that He is the strongest bulwark against human manipulation ("it was for freedom that Christ has set us free.")

John said...

Well, yes, but...

1. The Church is no safer than any other organization to avoid abuse in its ranks.

2. The Church, or any similar religious organization is more prevalent such abuse because it is structured around the notion that certain people and institutions have been given authority by God over other people. What secular organization boasts such grandiose authority?

This was the point at the end of the episode; the reason why the aliens chose to organize their slaves around a religion. It taught them that they had masters, and that they must obey them as a moral duty.

This weakness in the Church is intrinsic to the Church being a Church.

wrf3 said...

Concerning point 1, I'm not sure I agree. While the possibility of predation is the same as with any other organization, the Church has a written standard of behavior to which leaders must adhere. If they don't, then you have the choice of trying to reform the organization, or leaving. I had to do that, once. A pastor wanted me, as the church treasurer, to tell the congregation something that I new wasn't true. I wouldn't do it, found another church, and am very glad I did.

As for #2, "what secular organization boasts such grandiose authority"? All of them (or should): "there is no authority except from God, and those authorities that exist have bee instituted n by God." [Rom 13:1]. But Pharaoh and Nebuchadnezzar are examples of two leaders who were appointed by God, and were rightly disobeyed when their laws were in conflict with God's.

"The weakness in the Church is intrinsic to the Church being a Church." As Paul said, "for when I am weak then I am strong." You saw men acting in their own strength for their own desires. There is a greater power which is at the core of the Church.

John said...

Just imagine what would happen if an American President claimed to have been appointed to his position by God, and acted out of God's will. Yet this is routine in the Church.

"The weakness in the Church is intrinsic to the Church being a Church." As Paul said, "for when I am weak then I am strong." You saw men acting in their own strength for their own desires. There is a greater power which is at the core of the Church.If that power exists, I haven't seen it.

wrf3 said...

Just imagine what would happen if an American President claimed to have been appointed to his position by God, and acted out of God's will.I'd applaud him for acknowledging what Scripture says is the case.
Yet this is routine in the Church.It's supposed to be. But just because someone says they are acting in accordance with God's will doesn't mean that they are. That's one reason why John wrote to "test the spirits," and why Peter wrote that understanding of Scripture does not come from "private interpretation." The Biblical position on human government appears to be paradoxical: all government is put into place by God; yet civil disobedience is mandated when leaders don't measure up.

If that power exists, I haven't seen it.I wish I could help you. It's there.

JD said...

John,

I wrote a whole post on the a few years ago and defined church, for a lay person, as this:

"Church will be defined as a community of believers that have come together to worship our Lord, Jesus Christ, celebrate His Sacrifice, and enable the rest of the community to go out and 'preach the Gospel, and if need be, use words.'"The whole mess you got caught up in was much deeper than what a most lay people deal with and your pain and anger is legitimate. The awesome part about seeing the internal workings and not being as deeply involved as your were is way out with less pain, when the leaders of the church are not fulfilling their role as instructed by Christ.

Being powerless in a situation, especially one in which an individual poors his money, time, and self into, has to be the most infuriating experience one can endure.

Ultimately, a congregation led by corruptable men, corrupted by the world, is itself corrupt. That, ultimately is the problem, and an opportunity for redemption.

PAX
JD

larry said...

I've gotten so use to seeing Jeremy Sisto playing the detective now on Law and Order it was fun to see him in an different role! Good episode.

Religious organizations function on the premise that they carry out a divine mission, an assumption that rests on faith on the part of the participants. The divine mission may or may not be real, depending on the existence of God, or rather the existence of the faithful's particular understanding of God. The point, in part, of the episode, is that religious faith can be something that is easily manipulated.

For example, many people surely agree with wrf3 that a US president saying he has been selected by God is simply admitting what is true because Scripture says so (by your interpretation of the Bible on that point). Since there is really no human way to verify that claim as being either true or false, some people choose to accept it as true because it fits within the framework of other things they accept, fundamentally that the Christian God is sovereign in every aspect of the workings of the world. Yet that overarching belief in how God operates does not form in some vacuum. . . it is taught by some expressions of the Christian church. The teachings may be perfectly true, but the teachings appeal to that which ultimately requires faith in the transcendent. That makes the manipulation harder to root out . . . I don't mean to say that people who agree with wrf3 about the presidency have been manipulated into that belief, but when the foundation of your understanding rests on a God who is all powerful and the arbiter of all right and wrong, but is beyond question, then those ingredients can be a potent formula for creating a manipulative environment.

On the other hand, I can read the US Constitution and see pretty clearly the process by which US presidents are selected; while that may certainly take faith in the proper counting of votes and in the electoral college carrying out the will of the voters, at least such things are basically tangible. Voters can clearly be influenced and manipulated, but at the end of the day people can check facts about the claims candidates make regarding themselves and others.

Hope my comment made some sense . . .

John said...

wrf3 wrote:

I'd applaud him for acknowledging what Scripture says is the case.I'm pretty sure that you'd be in a very small minority. Consider how much criticism Bush 43 received when it was rumored that he claimed to have been instructed by God to invade Iraq. I don't recall anyone on the Right defend that point of view, only deny that he ever said that.

Now as Larry said, the notion that an earthly leader can claim authority from God makes an organization more prone to manipulate others, not less, because the claim is based on a transcendent authority that is beyond question.

John said...

JD wrote:

Ultimately, a congregation led by corruptable men, corrupted by the world, is itself corrupt. That, ultimately is the problem, and an opportunity for redemption.

Thank you for your compassionate response, JD. You have correctly identified the problem, but I would go one step further. The problem of the Church is that it can only succeed -- it can only be better than a non-spiritual organization -- if it is guided by the spirit of something greater than itself, both in terms of power and morality. But God left the Church a long time ago. Although there are righteous men and women in its ranks, they're fighting alone, without supernatural help.

JD said...

John said:
"But God left the Church a long time ago. Although there are righteous men and women in its ranks, they're fighting alone, without supernatural help."I am not sure I totally agree with that statement. God has not left the church, men have chosen not to listen. What is happening now is very similar to those things that were happening with the Catholic Church, right before the Reformation. The problem now: reformation becomes a "cleaning of our own house" as opposed to saying "we can do it better than you." No one is willing to look at one's self and make the necessary changes for Christ. That is the main place where satan is winning his battle: the disillusionment of Christ followers with the church organization and the organization's irresponsibility to do a check and correction of its own lack of Godliness in its ranks and the practice of Christ's teachings.

You are correct that the good pastors are fighting without supernatural help, but in the essence of splitting hairs, it is because they are not asking, and are trying to be led by man and culture and not by God.

The Methodist church is getting a little lazy as well. There is an understanding, and studies have shown, that the church itself is in decline. Despite this knowledge, it seems that those that run it are more concerned about their legacy and power than stepping up to the challenges they are facing, and doing something about it. The leaders acquiesce to the whims of a corrupt culture, which is exactly what bit you in the butt.

PAX
JD